Legislature(2007 - 2008)BUTROVICH 205

04/30/2007 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ HB 220 BAN COMPUTER-ASSISTED REMOTE HUNTING TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Time Limit May be Set> --
*+ SJR 6 OPPOSE WILDERNESS DESIGNATION FOR ANWR TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSSJR 6(RES) Out of Committee
-- Testimony <Time Limit May be Set> --
+= HB 152 ESTABLISH RENEWABLE ENERGY FUND/ACCOUNT TELECONFERENCED
Moved SCS CSHB 152(RES) Out of Committee
-- Testimony <Time Limit May be Set> --
+ HB 229 KENAI GASIFICATION PROJECT; RAILROAD BOND TELECONFERENCED
Moved HB 229 am Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
              SENATE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                         April 30, 2007                                                                                         
                           3:52 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Senator Charlie Huggins, Chair                                                                                                  
Senator Lyda Green                                                                                                              
Senator Gary Stevens                                                                                                            
Senator Lesil McGuire                                                                                                           
Senator Bill Wielechowski                                                                                                       
Senator Thomas Wagoner                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Senator Bert Stedman, Vice Chair                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 229 am                                                                                                           
"An   Act  authorizing   the  Alaska   Railroad  Corporation   to                                                               
participate  in   a  project   consisting  of   the  acquisition,                                                               
construction, improvement,  maintenance, equipping,  or operation                                                               
of  real   and  personal   property,  including   facilities  and                                                               
equipment, for the Kenai gasification  project and Port MacKenzie                                                               
rail link, authorizing the corporation  to issue bonds to finance                                                               
all or a  portion of the project, and identifying  these as bonds                                                               
for an  essential public and governmental  purpose; and providing                                                               
for an effective date."                                                                                                         
     MOVED HB 229 am OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 6                                                                                                   
Urging the United States Congress  to defeat House Resolution 39,                                                               
titled  "To  preserve the  Arctic  coastal  plain of  the  Arctic                                                               
National Wildlife  Refuge, Alaska,  as wilderness  in recognition                                                               
of  its extraordinary  natural ecosystems  and for  the permanent                                                               
good of present and future generations of Americans."                                                                           
     MOVED CSSJR 6(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 152(FIN)                                                                                                  
"An Act  establishing a  renewable energy  project account  and a                                                               
renewable energy fund and describing their uses and purposes."                                                                  
     MOVED SCS CSHB 152(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 220(JUD)                                                                                                  
"An Act prohibiting computer-assisted remote hunting."                                                                          
     HEARD AND HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 229                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: KENAI GASIFICATION PROJECT; RAILROAD BOND                                                                          
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) CHENAULT                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
03/29/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
03/29/07       (H)       FIN                                                                                                    
04/12/07       (H)       FIN AT 1:30 PM HOUSE FINANCE 519                                                                       
04/12/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
04/12/07       (H)       MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                            
04/13/07       (H)       FIN AT 1:30 PM HOUSE FINANCE 519                                                                       
04/13/07       (H)       Moved Out of Committee                                                                                 
04/13/07       (H)       MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                            
04/16/07       (H)       FIN RPT 2DP 4NR 1AM                                                                                    
04/16/07       (H)       DP: THOMAS, MEYER                                                                                      
04/16/07       (H)       NR: HAWKER, NELSON, CRAWFORD, KELLY                                                                    
04/16/07       (H)       AM: STOLTZE                                                                                            
04/25/07       (H)       BEFORE THE HOUSE                                                                                       
04/25/07       (H)       ENGROSSED                                                                                              
04/26/07       (H)       TRANSMITTED TO (S)                                                                                     
04/26/07       (H)       VERSION: HB 229 AM                                                                                     
04/27/07       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/27/07       (S)       RES                                                                                                    
04/30/07       (S)       RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SJR  6                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: OPPOSE WILDERNESS DESIGNATION FOR ANWR                                                                             
SPONSOR(s): RESOURCES                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
04/25/07       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/25/07       (S)       RES                                                                                                    
04/30/07       (S)       RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 152                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: ESTABLISH RENEWABLE ENERGY FUND/ACCOUNT                                                                            
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) HARRIS                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
02/26/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/26/07       (H)       CRA, FIN                                                                                               
03/06/07       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/06/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/06/07       (H)       MINUTE(CRA)                                                                                            
03/20/07       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/20/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/20/07       (H)       MINUTE(CRA)                                                                                            
03/22/07       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/22/07       (H)       Moved CSHB 152(CRA) Out of Committee                                                                   
03/22/07       (H)       MINUTE(CRA)                                                                                            
03/27/07       (H)       CRA RPT CS(CRA) NT 7DP                                                                                 
03/27/07       (H)       DP: CISSNA, DAHLSTROM, NEUMAN, SALMON,                                                                 
                         OLSON, FAIRCLOUGH, LEDOUX                                                                              
04/12/07       (H)       FIN AT 1:30 PM HOUSE FINANCE 519                                                                       
04/12/07       (H)       Scheduled But Not Heard                                                                                
04/13/07       (H)       FIN AT 1:30 PM HOUSE FINANCE 519                                                                       
04/13/07       (H)       Moved CSHB 152(FIN) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/13/07       (H)       MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                            
04/16/07       (H)       FIN RPT CS(FIN) NT 5DP 3NR                                                                             
04/16/07       (H)       DP: GARA, CRAWFORD, NELSON, THOMAS,                                                                    
                         MEYER                                                                                                  
04/16/07       (H)       NR: HAWKER, STOLTZE, KELLY                                                                             
04/19/07       (H)       TRANSMITTED TO (S)                                                                                     
04/19/07       (H)       VERSION: CSHB 152(FIN)                                                                                 
04/20/07       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/20/07       (S)       RES, FIN                                                                                               
04/25/07       (S)       RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
04/25/07       (S)       -- MEETING CANCELED --                                                                                 
04/30/07       (S)       RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 220                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: BAN COMPUTER-ASSISTED REMOTE HUNTING                                                                               
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) BUCH                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
03/26/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
03/26/07       (H)       RES, JUD, FIN                                                                                          
04/02/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/02/07       (H)       Moved CSHB 220(RES) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/02/07       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
04/03/07       (H)       RES RPT CS(RES) 6DP 3NR                                                                                
04/03/07       (H)       DP: ROSES, WILSON, GUTTENBERG, EDGMON,                                                                 
                         SEATON, GATTO                                                                                          
04/03/07       (H)       NR: KAWASAKI, KOHRING, JOHNSON                                                                         
04/13/07       (H)       JUD AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 120                                                                             
04/13/07       (H)       Moved CSHB 220(JUD) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/13/07       (H)       MINUTE(JUD)                                                                                            
04/16/07       (H)       JUD RPT CS(JUD) 5DP                                                                                    
04/16/07       (H)       DP: GRUENBERG, LYNN, SAMUELS, HOLMES,                                                                  
                         RAMRAS                                                                                                 
04/18/07       (H)       FIN REFERRAL WAIVED                                                                                    
04/20/07       (H)       TRANSMITTED TO (S)                                                                                     
04/20/07       (H)       VERSION: CSHB 220(JUD)                                                                                 
04/23/07       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/23/07       (S)       RES                                                                                                    
04/30/07       (S)       RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
LALANYA SNYDER                                                                                                                  
Staff to Representative Chenault                                                                                                
Alaska State Capitol                                                                                                            
Juneau, AK  99801-1182                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on HB 229 for the sponsor.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
LISA PARKER, Manager                                                                                                            
Government Relations                                                                                                            
Agrium                                                                                                                          
Kenai AK                                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 229 am.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
PAT GAMBELL, President and CEO                                                                                                  
Alaska Railroad Corporation (ARRC)                                                                                              
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 229 am.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
BILL LEARY, Chief Financial Officer                                                                                             
Alaska Railroad Corporation (ARRC)                                                                                              
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 229 am.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
DAVE HANSEN, Director                                                                                                           
Economic Development                                                                                                            
Mat-Su Borough                                                                                                                  
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Strongly supported HB 229 am.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SCOTT HAMANN                                                                                                                    
Kenai AK                                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 229 am.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
PAUL KENDALL                                                                                                                    
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Neutral position on HB 229 am, but supported                                                              
development of hydrogen.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
JODY SIMPSON                                                                                                                    
Staff to Senator Huggins                                                                                                        
Alaska State Capitol                                                                                                            
Juneau, AK  99801-1182                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT: Introduced SJR 6 for the sponsor.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
FRAN MAUER                                                                                                                      
Alaska Outdoor Council                                                                                                          
Fairbanks AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SJR 6.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
PAMELA MILLER, Arctic Coordinator                                                                                               
Northern Alaska Environmental Center                                                                                            
Fairbanks AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SJR 6.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MATTHEW GILBERT                                                                                                                 
Venetie Tribal Government                                                                                                       
Venetie AK                                                                                                                      
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SJR 6 and supported HB 152.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BILL THOMAS                                                                                                      
Alaska State Capitol                                                                                                            
Juneau, AK  99801-1182                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of HB 152.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHERISSE MILLETT                                                                                                                
Staff to Representative Harris                                                                                                  
Alaska State Capitol                                                                                                            
Juneau, AK  99801-1182                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented sectional analysis of HB 152.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
PETER CRIMP                                                                                                                     
Alaska Energy Authority (AEA)                                                                                                   
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Available to answer questions on HB 152.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CAITLIN HIGGENS, Acting Executive Director                                                                                      
Alaska Conservation Alliance                                                                                                    
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 152.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
WILLIAM PUTNAM, Acting Forestry Director                                                                                        
Tanana Chiefs Conference                                                                                                        
Fairbanks AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 152.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SARA FISHER-GOAD, Deputy Director of Operations                                                                                 
Alaska Energy Authority                                                                                                         
Anchorage AK                                                                                                                    
POSITION STATEMENT: Prepared an amendment for HB 152.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH                                                                                                             
Alaska State Capitol                                                                                                            
Juneau, AK  99801-1182                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of HB 220.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MATT ROBUS, Director                                                                                                            
Division of Wildlife Conservation                                                                                               
Alaska Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G)                                                                                      
Juneau AK                                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT: Suggested  working out language on  HB 220 at                                                             
a Board of Game meeting.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHARLIE  HUGGINS  called  the  Senate  Resources  Standing                                                             
Committee meeting to order at 3:52:56  PM. Present at the call to                                                             
order were Senators Wagoner, Wielechowski, Stevens and Huggins.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
       HB 229am-KENAI GASIFICATION PROJECT; RAILROAD BOND                                                                   
                                                                                                                              
3:53:36 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HUGGINS announced HB 229 am to be up for consideration.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
LALANYA SNYDER,  staff to Representative Chenault,  sponsor of HB
229, explained that Agrium owns  and operates an ammonia and urea                                                               
complex in the Kenai  area that has been at risk  for a number of                                                               
years of being shut down permanently  because of the lack of feed                                                               
stock.  So, the  Agrium Kenai  gasification project  has been  in                                                               
development. This  project would bring  coal from Healy  to Kenai                                                               
where low-emission  coal gasification and  electricity generation                                                               
plants would be built.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
HB  229  authorizes the  Alaska  Railroad  Corporation (ARRC)  to                                                               
issue  up to  $2.9  billion  in tax  exempt  bonds  to finance  a                                                               
portion  of the  project.  The project  will  also help  generate                                                               
electricity for  Southcentral Alaska  and generate  excess carbon                                                               
dioxide  that could  be used  to  improve oil  recovery from  the                                                               
wells in Cook Inlet and as  well as continue to supply fertilizer                                                               
to Alaska.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:54:44 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  SNYDER  explained  that  payment of  the  debt  service  for                                                               
facilities and  equipment that would  not be owned by  ARRC would                                                               
be  provided  through a  long-term  contract  or other  agreement                                                               
between ARRC and the project's  owner or operator. There would be                                                               
no fiscal impact to the state.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  asked if they had  heard of any resistance  to the                                                               
project or the bonding implications thus far.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS. SNYDER replied that she hadn't heard of any.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS asked  Ms. Parker of Agrium to  further explain the                                                               
concept.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:55:42 PM                                                                                                                    
LISA  PARKER, Manager,  Government Relations,  Agrium U.S.,  said                                                               
she  supported HB  229  am.  The concept  that  is imbedded  from                                                               
Agrium's standpoint with coal gasification  is that coal would be                                                               
transported from Healy to a  port facility and barged to Agrium's                                                               
facility where the coal would be  gasified. Part of the 3 million                                                               
tons of  coal per year  would be  used for creating  the hydrogen                                                               
Agrium  needs to  make anhydrous  ammonia and  the rest  would be                                                               
used  for  generating power.  The  complex  they are  envisioning                                                               
would generate  190 megawatts of  power - 120 megawatts  would be                                                               
used  at their  facility  for the  gasifier  air separation  unit                                                               
(ASU) and 70 megawatts would be  put into the grid without having                                                               
to  upgrade  the  existing  transmission  lines.  Homer  Electric                                                               
Association is taking the lead on the power generation-side.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:56:17 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATORS GREEN AND MCGUIRE joined the committee.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER  explained that Agrium's  plant has been  operating at                                                               
50 percent capacity  for half of the year and  they want to bring                                                               
it back to full operation.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:58:30 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WAGONER asked  if Agrium could get  its funding somewhere                                                               
else if this bill doesn't pass.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER replied they would be able to look for other avenues.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WAGONER said that this wasn't  a bail out, but rather one                                                               
method of financing.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER replied  that this mechanism was  established 20 years                                                               
ago as  a funding  mechanism by the  federal government  to allow                                                               
the  ARRC  to  issue  tax free  bonds  for  economic  development                                                               
projects  in Alaska.  From the  state's standpoint,  there is  no                                                               
state involvement. It is not a bail out.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:59:59 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked who pays if there is a default.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER  replied if the  legislature gives the  ARRC authority                                                               
to seek  tax-free bonds, it then  has to get permission  from its                                                               
board of directors  to seek those bonds. In  seeking those bonds,                                                               
they go to the bond  market which will thoroughly investigate the                                                               
Railroad, Agrium and its equity  partners in this process. If the                                                               
market does  not feel  that they  have the  resources to  pay for                                                               
those bonds, they would not issue them.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:00:47 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  asked if  the ARRC could  lose many  of its                                                               
assets if there was a default.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:01:01 PM                                                                                                                    
PAT  GAMBELL,  President  and CEO,  Alaska  Railroad  Corporation                                                               
(ARRC), said  the Railroad would  be responsible for  any portion                                                               
of the bonding  that would be used to purchase  assets on its own                                                               
-  in terms  of  locomotives  and coal  cars.  But  for the  vast                                                               
majority  of  the   dollars  they  are  talking   about  in  this                                                               
particular project, there  is no recourse to the state  or to the                                                               
ARRC.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. GAMBELL  said the ARRC's  participation is in two  parts. One                                                               
is the operational part, which would  be the movement of the coal                                                               
to an  offload point. Two  points are  being looked at  right now                                                               
and they are  looking at moving in the neighborhood  of 3 million                                                               
tons a  year, which is  significantly more  than it has  moved in                                                               
the past. So,  therefore, part of the tax-free  issuance would go                                                               
to purchase around 200 railcars  and probably 9 or 10 locomotives                                                               
that would go  into service full-time to move the  product to the                                                               
chosen port.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
He said the  second interest in this project is  to use this tool                                                               
for the economic  development that Ms. Parker  described. He also                                                               
wanted  to reinforce  the  idea  that this  is  absolutely not  a                                                               
bailout and it is simply a tool  and one that simply has not been                                                               
used up to this point in time.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:04:12 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  wanted to clarify that  there is absolutely                                                               
no state liability if there is a default.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  GAMBELL replied  that that  was true  as well  as unique  in                                                               
terms of the  U.S. tax code. The Alaska  Railroad properties were                                                               
left untouched in the tax rewrite of 1986.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:05:00 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI said  he wanted to hear more  about how it's                                                               
possible for the state or the  Railroad to have zero liability if                                                               
there's a default. And he wanted to hear it from a tax expert.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS.  PARKER  explained  that  the $2.9  billion  bond  has  three                                                               
components  or partners.  Agrium's portion  would be  $2 billion;                                                               
$600 million is designated for  the Railroad; and $300 million is                                                               
designated  for  a spur  line  through  the Mat-Su  Borough.  She                                                               
deferred the tax question to ARRC tax expert, Bill Leary.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:05:51 PM                                                                                                                    
BILL LEARY,  Chief Financial Officer,  ARRC, explained this  is a                                                               
very  big deal  to the  ARRC -  in that  it is  moving 3  million                                                               
incremental tons  of coal. With  regard to the  specific question                                                               
about recourse  to the  state or  to the  Railroad, he  said this                                                               
bill is only  an authorization to issue up to  $2.9 billion worth                                                               
of bonds.  The actual mechanics  of who would be  responsible for                                                               
repayment  of the  debt  would  be: first  it  would  need to  be                                                               
approved by  Railroad management, then  by the Railroad  Board of                                                               
Directors,  but   the  ultimate  control  would   come  from  the                                                               
marketplace.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
He assured them  that the ARRC's balance sheet  would not support                                                               
the issuance of anything with even a  $1 billion sign on it. As a                                                               
result, the  market would  dictate how much  could be  issued and                                                               
what the  repayment source would  be. So,  in this case,  a small                                                               
amount in the  grand scheme of things would have  the Railroad as                                                               
its  backstop -  for things  like the  railcars, locomotives  and                                                               
infrastructure improvements that would  be needed to support this                                                               
project, but the vast majority would  be supported by Agrium or a                                                               
combination  of Agrium  and  its partners.  That's  who would  be                                                               
responsible  for repaying  that  debt and  those  terms would  be                                                               
drawn up in the bond documents themselves.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked  if the bond could be used  to build a                                                               
spur line from the North Slope down to Southcentral.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:08:30 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. LEARY  replied that this  unique authority that  the Railroad                                                               
has, based  on language  in the  Transfer Act,  needs to  be tied                                                               
directly to  the Railroad and to  rail service. That is  why this                                                               
is  such  a  good  project  as  it's  proposed  with  the  Agrium                                                               
initiative.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:09:24 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked  if the bond could be used  to bring a                                                               
line to Southcentral.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  LEARY recalled  how  in 2004  the  Legislature approved  $17                                                               
billion  worth   of  railroad  bond  authorizations   related  to                                                               
financing the natural gas pipeline.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  HUGGINS said  that Senator  Wielechowski was  referring to                                                               
the authorization  in the event  that the spur line  existed that                                                               
pipe  and other  logistical support  requirements for  a pipeline                                                               
construction could be reverse-hauled north on it.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  GAMBELL responded  absolutely -  the reverse  haul potential                                                               
would  be excellent  from Port  MacKenzie into  the Interior.  He                                                               
hoped the  state would  consider that in  the engineering  of the                                                               
pipeline.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  said that is  one of the underpinnings  that makes                                                               
this attractive to him.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:11:03 PM                                                                                                                    
DAVE  HANSEN,  Director,  Economic Development,  Mat-Su  Borough,                                                               
strongly supported  HB 229 am.  They feel that an  extension from                                                               
the  main line  down to  Port  Mackenzie would  not only  greatly                                                               
enhance   the   Agrium   gasification    project   for   a   coal                                                               
transportation port,  but also would provide  extensive statewide                                                               
benefits - such  as making the development  of numerous strategic                                                               
mineral  deposits  in  the  Interior   more  cost  effective  and                                                               
feasible. One  study says Port  Mackenzie would be the  best port                                                               
for this purpose.  It would also reduce the need  to invest up to                                                               
$150  million in  rail crossing  improvements in  the Wasilla  to                                                               
Anchorage  rail corridor  and should  save Agrium  rail transport                                                               
money in its rail freight costs.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:13:30 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR STEVENS asked  if this project would have  the ability to                                                               
provide electricity beyond the needs of the Agrium plant.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. HANSEN replied that answer  would have two parts. Lisa Parker                                                               
would  have  to   answer  the  one  about   the  actual  electric                                                               
generation at the Agrium plant  that is part of the gasification.                                                               
But  he  could  answer  that  by putting  a  rail  line  to  Port                                                               
Mackenzie  you  make  the   possibility  of  electric  generation                                                               
through the  use of coal as  a fuel very feasible  and that could                                                               
be put on the main line system, the grid.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:14:41 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  PARKER added  that  Agrium's current  design  for the  power                                                               
plant is  for 190 megawatts  of power. Agrium would  purchase 120                                                               
percent  of  that  and  the   remaining  70  megawatts  would  be                                                               
available for distribution on the grid.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:15:14 PM                                                                                                                    
SCOTT HAMANN,  Kenai resident, said this  is a great bill  and it                                                               
is good for the whole state. This is just a win/win situation.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  asked Ms. Snyder to  give them an overview  of the                                                               
issues that were raised in the  other body on the bonding concept                                                               
and Agrium's viability.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:17:15 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  SNYDER   responded  that  Representative  Hawker   had  some                                                               
concerns with the size of the  bonding, but those were cleared up                                                               
by the Department of Revenue.  Representative Gara brought up the                                                               
issue of emissions and he offered  an amendment on the floor that                                                               
did not pass.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  HUGGINS asked  Ms. Parker  to review  the decision  points                                                               
Agrium has.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER replied  on July 1 Agrium will have  to decide whether                                                               
to go forward  on this project or not. It  was started in October                                                               
2004.  That decision  will be  based  on the  financials from  an                                                               
engineering standpoint,  for one  thing, and the  engineering has                                                               
been done.  They are continuing  to work on the  engineering, but                                                               
it has been found to be  feasible. The initial work on permitting                                                               
did not  identify any show-stoppers  and they will  be announcing                                                               
the selection  of the environmental  firm later this  week. After                                                               
July, if the  decision is made by management  and equity partners                                                               
to continue  the project, the next  gate would be in  the fall of                                                               
2008.  That would  be  as  to whether  or  not  Agrium goes  into                                                               
detailed engineering  and start procurement on  things that would                                                               
need a long  lead-time. She said if all gates  open, this project                                                               
would be on line by 2011/2012.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WAGONER  reminded them that  some people have  said using                                                               
CO2  in a  field such  as Swanson  River and  Cook Inlet  that an                                                               
additional 300  million barrels of  oil could be  recovered. When                                                               
you start  calculating what  the state  gets out  of that  at the                                                               
current price of oil per barrel, that's a big prize.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:20:06 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if Agrium  preferred to fuel its plant                                                               
with natural gas.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MS.  PARKER  replied  yes,  but  the supply  of  natural  gas  is                                                               
declining. The  plant was  closed for six  months because  it was                                                               
unable to get feed stock and  is operating at 25 percent capacity                                                               
on average.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER  said that two  other facilities were impacted  by the                                                               
same lack in Southcentral as  was a company that delivers natural                                                               
gas to  Fairbanks - but  the company  Fairbanks was able  to work                                                               
out an arrangement to get the natural gas from Enstar.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
She said they are looking at  a five-year time frame of trying to                                                               
keep their plant operating while  this gasification project comes                                                               
online.  Senior management  doesn't see  North Slope  natural gas                                                               
coming on  line in the  next 10  years and doesn't  foresee being                                                               
able to keep  the facility operating for that time  at 50 percent                                                               
capacity.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI   asked  how  soon  they   expected  to  be                                                               
gasifying coal under this proposal.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MS. PARKER  replied by 2011/12.  And management hopes to  be able                                                               
to get gas  to operate at least  half of their plant  for half of                                                               
the year during the construction time.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:22:17 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI again  voiced  his concern  that he  raised                                                               
when  the legislature  received this  presentation earlier  along                                                               
with one by Enstar that proposed  a bullet gasline from the North                                                               
Slope down to  Southcentral, which would cost almost  the same as                                                               
this project.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
His  concern was  if you  want  $2.9 billion  worth of  to get  a                                                               
bullet  gasline to  Southcentral,  you would  need  a big  anchor                                                               
tenant to pay  for it and Agrium is the  ideal anchor tenant. So,                                                               
if they go ahead with this  project, it hurts the state's ability                                                               
to bring  a natural  gas pipeline from  the North  Slope, because                                                               
they loose  Agrium as  an anchor  tenant - and  if the  state has                                                               
this opportunity  to bond,  he would  like to  see it  go towards                                                               
building a bullet gasline from  the North Slope and incorporating                                                               
the Railroad into  the building of a spur line.  "That way we get                                                               
you your gas, but we also  get gas for the hundreds of thousands,                                                               
the 71 percent  of Southcentral in Fairbanks  and Kenai residents                                                               
who use  natural gas, whose rates  have doubled in the  last five                                                               
years...."                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WAGONER  responded that  he  didn't  think that  concept                                                               
would fit the Railroad bonding capabilities.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:23:55 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. GAMBELL said  that was an interesting concept,  but the issue                                                               
is timing and  Agrium's timing is urgent.  The Railroad's bonding                                                               
capacity is not capped and it  could look at another project like                                                               
a bullet line  in the future. In fact, it  has discussed projects                                                               
with numerous other companies and he said:                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     It's certainly  feasible. The devil  is in  the details                                                                    
     in terms  of making arrangements  much as we  have with                                                                    
     Agrium to  satisfy the requirement that  the project is                                                                    
     for  railroad  purposes.   So  therefore,  property  or                                                                    
     right-of-way,   or  some   sort   of   support,  or   a                                                                    
     combination of all the above  may very well prove to be                                                                    
     the right  formula at  some point  in the  future. That                                                                    
     point,  however, is  certainly  farther  down the  road                                                                    
     than  the  current  concern that  Agrium  has  for  its                                                                    
     inability to put capacity out of its plant.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     We'd be  very happy to talk  with the state or  look at                                                                    
     that  initiative as  well,  and we  can,  because as  a                                                                    
     conduit financer  and with this  capability we  have we                                                                    
     would  not  be  capped  and   in  fact  could  look  at                                                                    
     something like that.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:25:27 PM                                                                                                                    
PAUL KENDALL, Anchorage resident, said  he was not endorsing this                                                               
project,  but  he wanted  to  suggest  that  the future  lies  in                                                               
hydrogen.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  STEVENS moved  to pass  HB  229 am  from committee  with                                                               
individual recommendations and attached fiscal note.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  objected saying he  wanted HB 229 to  get a                                                               
Finance Committee referral for  his previously mentioned reasons.                                                               
It  is not  a bad  project, but  it is  only one  project and  he                                                               
preferred to see  the bonding go towards a gas  pipeline from the                                                               
North  Slope  to  Southcentral that  would  provide  natural  gas                                                               
energy for  Agrium along with  energy for the many  residents all                                                               
up and down the Railbelt.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  said they  could not discount  the value  of being                                                               
able to  reverse hauling  to the North  in logistical  support of                                                               
any pipeline and  secondly that the LNG plant can  be viewed as a                                                               
potential anchor  for a large  natural gas supply. And  he didn't                                                               
think they were mutually exclusive.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote was  taken: Senators Stevens, Wagoner, Green and                                                               
Huggins voted yea; Senator Wielechowski  voted nay; and HB 229 am                                                               
moved from committee.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:29:03 PM at ease 4:31:07 PM                                                                                               
         SJR  6-OPPOSE WILDERNESS DESIGNATION FOR ANWR                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:31:53 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HUGGINS announced SJR 6 to be up for consideration.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
JODY  SIMPSON,  staff  to  Senator  Huggins,  explained  that  in                                                               
January 2007,  Representatives Edward J. Markey  of Massachusetts                                                               
and Jim Ramstad of Minnesota introduced  HR 39 as an extension of                                                               
the Udall/Eisenhower  Arctic Wilderness  Act and it  was referred                                                               
to the  U.S. House Resources  Committee. A copy  of HR 39  was in                                                               
their packets. She said that SJR 6 addresses that resolution.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:32:31 PM                                                                                                                    
She said further:                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Oil and  gas exploration and development  of the Arctic                                                                    
     Coastal Plain  could result  in discoveries  that would                                                                    
     reduce our  nation's future need on  imported oil, help                                                                    
     balance  the nation's  trade deficit  and significantly                                                                    
     increase the  nation's security. You have  paperwork in                                                                    
     your packet that speaks to  the vast economic potential                                                                    
     for this project.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     In   1980   the    Alaska   National   Interest   Lands                                                                    
     Conservation Act  (ANILCA) Congress reserved  the right                                                                    
     to permit further activities  within the Coastal Plain.                                                                    
     At this  time, 8.9 million  of the 19 million  acres of                                                                    
     the Refuge  have already been set  aside as wilderness.                                                                    
     Current  enhancements in  technology can  be used  in a                                                                    
     manner that  minimizes the area within  the Refuge that                                                                    
     is   used  for   exploration   and  development   while                                                                    
     providing the  nation with a  needed supply of  oil and                                                                    
     gas. This resolution before you,  if adopted, urges the                                                                    
     U.S.  Congress to  defeat HR  39 and,  therefore, allow                                                                    
     additional activities within the Coastal Plain.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. SIMPSON  said she worked  with Daniel  Kish who works  on the                                                               
House Committee  on Resources in  Washington, D.C. to  draft this                                                               
language  and she  pointed out  a series  of amendments  that our                                                               
drafters provided that are mostly housekeeping measures.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:34:18 PM                                                                                                                    
FRAN  MAUER,  Alaska  Outdoor  Council,  said he  is  a  36  year                                                               
resident of  Alaska and  a graduate of  the University  of Alaska                                                               
Fairbanks.  During  his  time  in   the  state  he  has  had  the                                                               
opportunity to  work with the  wildlife biologists on  the Arctic                                                               
Refuge Coastal  Plain and he  has made many personal  trips there                                                               
as  well. He  opposed  SJR 6  because the  Coastal  Plain of  the                                                               
Arctic  Refuge is  the most  essential area  of an  international                                                               
eco-system that is unparalleled  in the entire circumpolar region                                                               
for its wildlife and its wilderness values.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
He asserted, "Indeed,  designation of this area  as wilderness by                                                               
the U.S. Congress  is actually the right thing  to do" especially                                                               
with  the  ever-growing   implications  of  human-induced  global                                                               
warming. Now  is the time  for Alaska  to show leadership  in the                                                               
development  of clean  renewable energy  resources such  as wind,                                                               
geothermal and tidal and not to continue as the supplier of oil.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:36:36 PM                                                                                                                    
PAMELA MILLER, Arctic  Coordinator, Northern Alaska Environmental                                                               
Center,  urged  that the  United  State  and Alaska  move  toward                                                               
getting off of  fossil fuels. She said  the Interior Department's                                                               
environmental  statement that  the  congressional drilling  bills                                                               
rely  on state  that oil  and  gas development  would damage  the                                                               
wilderness character  of the Coastal  Plain and that it  would be                                                               
irretrievably lost as a result.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
She asked if the state's  citizens should really trust Exxon, BP,                                                               
and  ConocoPhillips  after  what  happened  last  year  with  the                                                               
largest  crude  oil spill  ever  in  the  North Slope  caused  by                                                               
negligent corrosion.  Industry has  not demonstrated that  it can                                                               
be  trusted on  environmental  health and  safety.  She said  the                                                               
National Research  Council in 2003 found  that cumulative impacts                                                               
from  North Slope  development harmed  the land,  birds, caribou,                                                               
endangered bowhead whale migration  and other wildlife and Alaska                                                               
Native culture.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
She opposed  SJR 6 saying that  even Gene Iacocca, former  CEO of                                                               
Chrysler Corporation, said we need  to think about our future use                                                               
of fossil fuels.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WAGONER asked who funds her group.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. MILLER replied that is funded by its members and by grants.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:41:11 PM                                                                                                                    
MATTHEW GILBERT,  Venetie Tribal  Government, said he  is Gwichen                                                               
Athabascan.  He opposed  SJR 6  because oil  and gas  development                                                               
would  detrimentally harm  the Porcupine  caribou  herd on  which                                                               
Gwichens critically  rely on for  food, subsistence  and cultural                                                               
ways.  They  have been  fighting  this  issue  for 25  years.  He                                                               
stated:                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     I  believe  it is  beating  a  dead horse  because  the                                                                    
     country has voted again and  again in support of us and                                                                    
     it's been defeated  in Congress over and  over. I think                                                                    
     this is just  distracting us from a  real true economic                                                                    
     policy, which  is renewable  energy because  our fossil                                                                    
     fuels   are   running   out.  It's   worsening   global                                                                    
     warming....                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. GILBERT also said that he supported HB 152.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:44:42 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GREEN moved Amendment 1 that consisted of housekeeping                                                                  
issues.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
                                                 25-LS0869\A.1                                                                  
                                                      Bullock                                                                   
                              AMENDMENT 1                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     OFFERED IN THE HOUSE                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 1:                                                                                                            
          Delete "House Resolution"                                                                                           
          Insert "H.R."                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 6:                                                                                                            
          Delete "House Resolution"                                                                                             
          Insert "H.R."                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 4:                                                                                                            
          Delete "ANCILA"                                                                                                       
          Insert "ANILCA"                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 17:                                                                                                           
          Delete "House Resolution"                                                                                             
          Insert "H.R."                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
There were no objections and Amendment 1 was adopted.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  STEVENS moved  to pass  SCS SJR  6(RES) with  individual                                                               
recommendations. There were no objections and it was so ordered.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:45:31 PM at ease 4:47:00 PM                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     CSHB 152(FIN)-ESTABLISH RENEWABLE ENERGY FUND/ACCOUNT                                                                  
4:47:07 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR   HUGGINS   announced   CSHB   152(FIN)  to   be   up   for                                                               
consideration.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BILL THOMAS,  sponsor of HB 152, said  in 2003 the                                                               
Alaska   Task  Force   recommended   that   the  state   increase                                                               
development of  renewable resources. Further, with  the high cost                                                               
of fuel in  Alaska it has been very difficult  for rural Alaskans                                                               
to prosper  and many have  to decide if  they want to  heat, have                                                               
heat,  fuel  or  health  care.  He said  the  time  has  come  to                                                               
seriously  explore  other renewable  sources  of  energy such  as                                                               
wind, geothermal, solar and hydro.  Many communities have already                                                               
been researching ways  to secure cleaner and  more cost efficient                                                               
energy  and they  need funding  to help  harness these  renewable                                                               
sources of power.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE THOMAS  said that  HB 152 establishes  a renewable                                                               
energy  fund which  will be  administrated by  the Alaska  Energy                                                               
Authority  (AEA).   AEA  would  take  advice   from  an  advisory                                                               
committee  with members  appointed by  the governor  from various                                                               
utilities,  environmental  businesses,   and  Native  stakeholder                                                               
groups.  The fund  will offer  both  loan and  grant options  for                                                               
Alaskans  to develop  renewable  energy  projects throughout  the                                                               
state.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:49:42 PM                                                                                                                    
CHERISSE MILLETT,  staff to Representative Harris,  presented the                                                               
sectional analysis. She highlighted  that grants are eligible for                                                               
new  projects only  and can  use a  renewable energy  resource or                                                               
natural  gas. Natural  gas is  used as  a last  resort for  those                                                               
communities  in rural  Alaska that  don't  have renewable  energy                                                               
sources. Any natural gas project  has to benefit a community with                                                               
a population of 10,000 or less.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
She said  that the loan fund  is revolving so it  doesn't deplete                                                               
itself and the grant fund was  designed as a percentage of market                                                               
value making it sustainable once the money is appropriated.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:52:48 PM                                                                                                                    
PETER  CRIMP,   Alaska  Energy  Authority  (AEA),   said  he  was                                                               
available to answer questions.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:53:15 PM                                                                                                                    
CAITLIN HIGGENS,  Acting Executive Director,  Alaska Conservation                                                               
Alliance,  strongly supported  HB  152. She  said, "Blessed  with                                                               
unparalleled   renewable  energy   resources,   Alaska  has   the                                                               
opportunity to lead American and  the world in the development of                                                               
clean renewable energy resources...."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:54:46 PM                                                                                                                    
WILLIAM   PUTNAM,  Acting   Forestry   Director,  Tanana   Chiefs                                                               
Conference,   said  the   Conference  is   a  non-profit   Native                                                               
corporation  which provides  a variety  of services  to about  40                                                               
villages  scattered  around  Interior  Alaska  and  as  such  its                                                               
primary clients are  the village and tribal  governments. Many of                                                               
the  programs  the  Tanana  Chiefs  direct  try  to  improve  the                                                               
economic  and social  sustainability  of  those communities.  The                                                               
increasing cost of  using fossil fuels has made  it imperative to                                                               
develop  renewable alternative  resources  for  energy. He  fully                                                               
supported  HB  152 saying  that  many  of  the villages  lack  to                                                               
resources to pursue some of  these options themselves and many of                                                               
them  are   interested  in   bio-energy  and   bio-mass  resource                                                               
development in achieving self sufficiency.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SARA FISHER-GOAD,  Deputy Director  of Operations,  Alaska Energy                                                               
Authority, said she had prepared an amendment.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS moved to adopt Amendment 1 as follows:                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     On page 1, line 11: delete the comma after "river."                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
       On page 3, line 9: insert "..., which shall be the                                                                       
        fiduciary of the fund under AS 37.10.071." after                                                                        
     "Revenue," (requested by the Department of Revenue)                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
      On page 3, lines 7 & 8, delete the first instance of                                                                      
     "energy" and insert "electricity," and delete "run on"                                                                     
     and insert "use hydrogen from"                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
      On page 3, lines 9 & 10: delete (D) in its entirety                                                                       
     because it is covered in (E)                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     On page 5, line 21: delete the comma after "river"                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:57:30 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. MILLETT said that the changes in Amendment 1 were all minor.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  STEVENS  asked  for  the  rationale  used  to  make  the                                                               
eligibility for 10,000 people or less.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:59:28 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  THOMAS  explained  that  they  followed  the  gas                                                               
pipeline  from Prudhoe  Bay to  Fairbanks, took  a left  and came                                                               
down  the Highway.  There are  no communities  in between  and he                                                               
didn't want to encourage people to  use natural gas since that is                                                               
the last  option. That  area also  has no river,  no wind  and no                                                               
hydro energy. He  wanted to keep some communities  from using all                                                               
the natural  gas the state is  trying to sell down  south as well                                                               
as encourage alternative energy sources.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  found no  further objections  and Amendment  1 was                                                               
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:59:51 PM4:59:51 PM                                                                                                          
CHAIR HUGGINS asked if HB 152 had met any resistance.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE THOMAS  responded that he found  no resistance and                                                               
has rather received  compliments; he pointed out  that the Denali                                                               
Commission is also one of the designees.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:00:54 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  STEVENS moved  to  pass SCS  HB  152(RES) with  attached                                                               
fiscal  note  and  individual   recommendations.  There  were  no                                                               
objections and it was so ordered.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
       CSHB 220(JUD)-BAN COMPUTER-ASSISTED REMOTE HUNTING                                                                   
5:02:14 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR   HUGGINS   announced   CSHB   220(JUD)  to   be   up   for                                                               
consideration.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH,  sponsor of HB  220, related that  26 states                                                               
have already  banned computer-assisted remote hunting  and others                                                               
are in the process of it. When  he first heard about this type of                                                               
hunting, he thought it  was a joke, but then he  found out it was                                                               
not.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
He said  that Internet hunting is  when a person anywhere  in the                                                               
world can  shoot animals  from their living  rooms by  hooking up                                                               
their computers  to a  rifle through Internet.  They are  able to                                                               
control  the aiming  and firing  of the  rifle from  the computer                                                               
keypad  and to  make a  kill with  the click  of the  mouse. This                                                               
practice  began in  Texas in  2005 when  an entrepreneur  offered                                                               
people  the ability  to shoot  big game  on his  land via  remote                                                               
control technology.  The Texas legislature  shut him  down. Since                                                               
then, 26 states have passed  legislation to ban this practice and                                                               
legislation in 8 other states  is currently pending. HB 122 would                                                               
prohibit this despicable practice in Alaska.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH  concluded, "As everyone knows,  we have some                                                               
of the best big game in the world  in Alaska. We need to ban this                                                               
practice before  it hits. I  want to make  sure the guys  who are                                                               
doing this don't come here."                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
He  said  that HB  122  prohibits  individuals from  engaging  in                                                               
Internet  hunting  in  Alaska.  It  also  prohibits  anyone  from                                                               
providing   services   or    operating   facilities   to   enable                                                               
computerized hunting activities.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
5:04:47 PM                                                                                                                    
MATT ROBUS,  Director, Division of Wildlife  Conservation, Alaska                                                               
Department  of  Fish   and  Game  (ADF&G),  said   he  wanted  to                                                               
specifically  address section  (b), which  addresses people  with                                                               
disabilities  and the  Americans  with Disabilities  Act. He  was                                                               
supportive  of  it,  but  said  today  he  became  aware  of  the                                                               
existence  of an  idea to  add an  amendment that  would prohibit                                                               
another type  of hunting activating  using remote TV  cameras for                                                               
something called "electronic patterning."                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
He related  how he had  a discussion with the  executive director                                                               
of the  Alaska Outdoor  Council (AOC) and  the Department  of Law                                                               
before  coming to  the meeting  to figure  out language,  but the                                                               
consensus was that language to  prohibit that type of activity is                                                               
not simple  and has a lot  of nuances. It's the  type of activity                                                               
that is usually prohibited through  5 AAC 92.080, which prohibits                                                               
the use of  cell phones, radios, pits, and fires  and things like                                                               
that for the  taking of wildlife. Electronic  patterning seems to                                                               
be the type of  activity that might fit into that  and if so, the                                                               
Board of  Game has a  statewide regulatory meeting  scheduled for                                                               
January  2008 in  which that  particular section  of the  code is                                                               
open. So he  thought that type of language could  be hammered out                                                               
there through  the public proposal  process better than  here. He                                                               
said  that  Rod  Arno,  Executive  Director,  AOC,  expressed  an                                                               
interest in going in that direction.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  HUGGINS thanked  him and  said HB  220 would  be held  for                                                               
further coordination and passed out  on Wednesday. There being no                                                               
further business to  come before the committee,  he adjourned the                                                               
meeting at 5:08:11 PM.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                

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